Showing posts with label American Revenue Association. Show all posts
Showing posts with label American Revenue Association. Show all posts

Thursday, January 23, 2025

The American Revenuer, 4th Quarter 2024: Listing an R163 Bisect in the Scott Catalog

Consider this post a part of a campaign to add a new listing the US Scott Specialized Catalog.  Over the past year or so, two different troves of bisects have come to the attention of this philatelist, and with the assistance of Frank Sente, David Thompson and Dan Harding, an article was published this past quarter on those bisects in The American Revenuer, aka "TAR".  Below is a slightly altered version of that aricle.


The Case for a New Scott U. S. Specialized Catalog Listing: The R163 One Cent Battleship Bisect
by John Langlois and Frank Sente

The Issue

The Scott U. S. Specialized Catalog should list an R163 bisect. Ten bisected examples of the 1898 one cent battleship revenue stamp, Scott number R163, are known to the authors to exist on document fragments and are pictured here. While the Scott U. S. Specialized Catalog lists a one cent I.R. overprinted R154 bisect, R154d, there is no listing for an R163 bisect, despite overwhelming evidence of the legitimate existence of these bisects.

The Evidence

The verified examples are made up of stamps tied to document fragments by hand stamped cancels on paper consistent with insurance documents, and were produced by three different sources: the Northern Assurance Company (3 examples), and the insurance agents H. D. Eichelberger of Richmond Virginia (6 examples) and D. Redfield & Son of Ardmore, Indian Territory (1 example).








 

Background

Starting in 2017, the Scott US Specialized Catalog began a new listing under the number R154, the provisionally I. R. overprinted one cent Scott 279 postage stamp; the bisect is assigned Scott Number R154d. Len McMaster and Frank Sente soon published an article on the bisect in the 2017 fourth quarter edition of The American Revenuer, illustrating three different examples of R154d, including two on full documents: a travel accident policy and a plate glass insurance policy, in addition to an insurance document fragment. The conclusion called for collectors to share usage examples of bisected provisionals and battleships, and included a reference to Joseph Einstein’s 1986 TAR report of two one cent battleship bisects on document fragments. This article provides examples of both, including R154d with manuscript cancels produced by the same H. D. Eichelberger & Company that produced hand stamped tied battleship bisects.




The overprinted postage stamps did not include a half cent value, though the new war revenue law taxed insurance premiums (except for life insurance) at one half cent on the dollar. Some insurance companies or their agents may have occasionally been in a position to charge odd dollar premiums early in the tax period when only one cent stamps were available. According to the 1898 War Revenue Law: Except for life insurance, all classes of insurance were taxed by the 1898 War Revenue Law “...upon the amount of premium charged, one-half of one percent on each dollar or fractional part thereof...”, such that any policy with a premium ending in an odd dollar value required a half cent stamp alone or in combination with other stamps to pay the tax obligation. In effect this meant that most uses of the half cent stamps were on lower cost policies, as higher value policies usually had premiums with even dollar amounts.

The Half Cent Battleship Stamps: To enable insurance customers and businesses to not overpay on odd-dollar premiums, the BEP belatedly produced half cent battleship stamps, making an orange version (Scott R161) available by July 11, 1898 according to the Boston Revenue Book, changing the color to gray (Scott R162) “very soon” after the debut of orange. So the half cent documentary stamps were available approximately two and a half weeks after the one and two cent battleships. Data regarding the distribution of the half cent stamps is unavailable, but it is likely that availability of the half cent stamps was uneven early in the tax period in 1898, especially in July and August.

 


Origin and Description of the R163 Bisect Examples

The Eichelberger Bisects: In 2023, a small, nondescript and handmade stamp album was posted for auction on Ebay. The album consisted entirely of 1898 series documentary revenue stamps, all used and canceled by the Travelers Insurance Company or their agents. Among the pages of stamps were the cancels of the insurance agent H. D. Eichelberger & Company of Richmond, Virginia. Most of their cancels were on stamps off-document on several values of the battleship documentary series. But there were eight examples of document fragments, all on pink paper, with enough of the language on the documents remaining to indicate they were once accident insurance contracts or policies.

Two of the fragments included vertical bisects of R154, manuscript canceled in September, 1898, and six fragments included vertical bisects of the one cent battleship, R163, handstamp and manuscript canceled in August, 1898, tying them to the document fragments. The six R163 bisects include a complete R163 plus R163 bisect for a 1 1/2 cent tax payment, two examples of R164 plus a R163 bisect for a 2 1/2 cent tax payment, two R164 plus whole R163 plus R162 bisect for a 3 1/2 cent tax payment, and one example of two R164s plus a R163 bisect for a 4 1/2 cent tax payment. The Eichelberger bisects are in the collection of John Langlois.

The Northern Assurance Company Bisects: Also in 2023, and listed by a completely different seller, several examples of Northern Assurance Company bisects were listed on Ebay. All appear to be solo uses, for premiums that were for one dollar or less. At least five of these were sold, and three original copies are available to the authors for inspection. ARA members Dan Harding and David Thompson own the examples shown in this article.

The D. Redfield & Son Bisect: The D. Redfield bisect was sold in 2012 in a Robert Siegel auction and is in the collection of Frank Sente.

Listing the One Cent Battleship Bisect

As Len McMaster and Frank Sente argued in 2017, insurance companies and agents were required to comply with the new war revenue law but were sometimes without half cent stamps, especially early in the tax period. One option enabling agents to comply was to bisect the current one cent documentary stamps, including the overprinted R154, the now listed R154d. Based on the examples provided, there is clear evidence that agents did the same with R163, the one cent battleship. Time for the Scott US Specialized Catalog to provide a listing for this bisect, perhaps Scott R163c?

References:

Einstein, Joseph S. 1986. R163 Bisect--Rarity or Just Uncommon? The American Revenuer, Vol. 40 No. 10 (November-December), p.201.

McMaster, Len and Frank Sente. 2017. Bisected “I.R.” Provisional Overprints. The American Revenuer, Vol. 70, No. 4 (Fourth Quarter), pp. 115-116.

Toppan, George L., Hiram E. Deats and Alexander Holland. An Historical Reference List of the Revenue Stamps of the United States, aka “The Boston Revenue Book”, The Boston Philatelic Society, 1899.

Advertisement sources:

H. D. Eichelberger advertisement is from the Virginia Federation of Labor Directory, 1897

D. Redfield & Son advertisement is from the Daily Ardmoreite, August 8, 1899

Northern Assurance Company advertisement is from The Weekly Underwriter, April 28, 1906

 










Post Script:
While the article was going to press, The Philatelic Foundation returned positive certificates for several of the featured bisects, reinforcing the argument for a new Scott listing.




Thursday, March 31, 2016

The Early Days of the American Revenue Association

The American Revenue Association is one of the oldest collector's organizations in philately, as is its flagship journal, The American Revenuer.  In 1898, the Association made its first bond issue to pay for expansion of its offices in order to cope with rapidly expanding demand for the The American Revenuer.  Today at 1898 Revenues we present an exciting find of a tax stamp from that bond, with the prominent cancel, T. A. R.


T. A. R.
Oct 28.
1898

John Langlois scan

Often known as TAR to organization members, The American Revenuer is the journal published by The American Revenue Association.  The stamp above was undoubtedly used on an 1898 bond floated by the The ARA's bank to finance early capital improvements to the extensive printing works of the Association.

Two summers ago, at a meeting of the American Revenue Association in Minnesota, I asked some of the members who were there at the association's beginning what it was like at the ARA during those heady times of bond floats and construction projects:

Herman Ivester:  "I didn't have much to do with the ARA back then.  I was mostly interested in tracking down the St. Louis provisionals, working everyday to stay a step ahead of Charlie Nast.  Many thanks to Bob Hohertz for his help.  Bob gave himself the internet handle rdhinstl from his days in St. Louis back then.  He helped track down a few of the rarities with me.  

Ron Lesher:  "I was teaching physics in those days, but it was a more basic job in 1898.  Marie and Pierre (Curie) only discovered radium that year; the curriculum was more Isaac Newton than Albert Einstein.  I taught a basic revenue stamp collecting course for the ARA in 1899, and had hundreds attend every lecture.  

Richard Friedberg:  "I was the Mayor of Meadville when the ARA moved its headquarters into an old fireworks factory in town.  The city was grateful for the move.  The ARA put an old property to use that was derelict.  The bond used to finance the purchase of the building to house the new TAR printing presses used the 50c documentary battleship tax stamp.  This is the first of these stamps I've seen in years.  Its a shame it is off-document, but I'm still prepared to offer Langlois $75,000 for the stamp.

Bob Hohertz:  "I was a young member of the ARA back then.  A bunch of the older guys (including Mort Joyce) put me up to a stunt sometime in 1903 where they distracted the agents in the Pere Marquette ticket office in Detroit while I sneaked out with a box of cancelled parlor car tickets.  It was a youthful indiscretion, but look what was preserved for philately!...It didn't occur to me in 1898 that I would have become an actuary.  If I had known that me and Herman and Ron and all the rest of us would live as long has we have, I don't think I would have had the confidence to be an actuary -- Sheppard Homans' table doesn't seem to apply to any of us.  I think all of my employers would have gone bankrupt.

Frank Sente:  "Nassau Street in New York was the center of American philately in those days.  Unfortunately, it was also the center of philatelic fraud.  I ran a special program for the ARA to monitor and report this fraud.  Now that we've entered the internet and Ebay age, the bad guys are more technically sophisticated, but in 1898, preventing fraud was still a major challenge.

Mike Mahler:  "I was an active member of the ARA in those days.  But it would be years before I would become involved with TAR, as I was working day and night helping to put together what we call today The Boston Book.  The plan was to have the book come out in '98 but we missed.  It went to press in 1899.  Thanks to Ken Trettin for all the work he had done for years on the book before I came in to help out starting in '97.  Thanks to the new presses in the Meadville facility, we were able to produce an initial run of 10,000 copies.  They sold out in days and we had to go to a second printing.

David Thompson:  In 1898, The Air Force was limited to a couple of squadrons of balloons, but we used them for observation over San Juan Hill during Roosevelt's charge.  When I returned to the States in '99 I started collecting the battleship series, and I've also been a member of The American Revenue Association ever since. 

Eric Jackson:  "This stamp with the T. A. R. cancel is one of the rarest in revenue philately.  I'm prepared to offer John six figures for this stamp.  John, where should I mail the check?"

Monday, April 29, 2013

1898 Revenue Exhibits at ARIPEX all Garner Gold Awards and Another Phoenix Check

1898 Revenue exhibits did well at ARIPEX!  All four of the 1898 revenue exhibits garnered Gold Medals! 

Additionally, Hermann Ivester's single frame exhibit, The Saint Louis Provisionals 1898, won the show's Single Frame GRAND AWARD, the ARA's award for the best revenue single frame exhibit, and the American Association of Philatelic Exhibitor's special award for the exhibit having the Best Title Page. 

Winning the ARIPEX single frame grand award, automatically qualifies Hermann's exhibit for the national single frame "Champion of Champions" competition at Ameristamp Expo in Little Rock Arkansas in February 2014!  Congratulations Hermann!! 

The ARIPEX multi-frame RESERVE GRAND award went to Frank Sente's 10 frame exhibit, Spanish American War Fiscal History: The US Documentary Taxes 1898-1902.  Sente's exhibit also was awarded the American Revenue Association Grand Award as the best overall revenue exhibit.       

Standing in front of Len McMaster's exhibit from left to right are:
Frank Sente, Len McMaster, Hermann Ivester, and Bob Hohertz
 
1898Revenue blog readers can enjoy much of the material in these four exhibits vicariously. 
 
Len McMaster's, "I. R." Overprinted 1898 1cent Franklin Postage Stamps, exhibit is available online here at 1898Revenues.
 
Many of the 1898 Saint Louis Provisional Issues in Hermann Ivester's exhibit and much more information about them can be found here on 1898Revenues.  And now that Hermann's wonderful material is in exhibit format, we'll be asking him to scan those 16 pages to put up on 1898Revenues.  
 
It was a thrill for me to view Hermann's exhibit as all I've ever been able to do is read about these stamps. Previous owners of the material never exhibited it, Hermann being the first ever to do so! 
 
Bob Hohertz  has blogged extensively about the revenue stamp paper of the 1898 tax era on 1898Revenues. Much of the material in his exhibit, Revenue Stamped Paper of the Spanish American War Tax Era, may be found in his blogs.
 
And finally, individual blogs about some of the items from my exhibit, Spanish American War Fiscal History: The Documentary Taxes 1898-1902, can be found among the On Document Uses blogs on 1898Revenues.    
 
Shows aren't just about exhibits and awards however; more importantly they provide a venue where collectors, exhibitors and dealers can meet, trade information, and discuss mutual interests.  The camaraderie and good fellowship developed from face to face meetings with others having similar interests far outweighs awards. 
 
I finally got to meet 1898 revenue contributor Sean Roberts.  Len McMaster and I discussed a joint article about bisect stamp usages from the 1898 tax era, and I attended the meetings of the American Revenue Association.  And I would be remiss if I didn't provide a link to the American Revenue Association website; it's their annual meeting that I'm attending at ARIPEX prompting these Phoenix-related blogs.
 
Here's an interesting bank check.  Other than being datelined Phoenix, Arizona, it's a generic printed form; essentially it could have been used at any bank!
 
Bank of Arizona check on generic check form
January 27, 1899
 
Drawn by John Lawler against the Bank of Arizona, Prescot, Aziz. (Note mis-spelling of Prescott) it was made payable to "Valley Bank" or bearer.  The pair of one-cent large I. R. overprint stamps paying the 2cent check tax apparently were applied at the bank as they bear a double ring cancel reading: "The Valley Bank"/ "Phoenix, Arizona"
 
John Lawler was a prominent Prescott businessman who had extensive cattle and mining interests.  His papers are available at the University of Arizona.  Perhaps he was on business in Phoenix and picked up this form check at the Valley Bank to secure $200 cash. 
 
As I now live in Prescott, Arizona it's a treasured item in my 1898 collection.
 
             
   
              
           
 

Friday, April 19, 2013

ARA Meeting at ARIPEX 2013 and an Interesting Phoenix National Bank Check

The American Revenue Association is holding its annual meeting at ARIPEX 2013 this weekend in Mesa, Arizona.  The show runs from Friday April 19 through Sunday April 21 at the Mesa Convention Center

The show is open to the public at no charge and features 226 frames of philatelic exhibits and more than 40 participating dealers.  Although not all of them are exhibiting 1898 revenue material, six contributors to the 1898REVENUES blog have  exhibits at the show: Bob Hohertz, Frank Sente, Len McMaster, Ron Lesher (Court of Honor), Hermann Ivester, and Mike Mahler.  A seventh contributor, Sean Roberts, has a dealer booth. 

In addition to the ARA, other groups having meetings at the show are: the State Revenue Society, the US Possessions Philatelic Society, the American Society of Check Collectors, and the American Airmail Society.  A special court of honor exhibit featuring several Buffalo Balloon stamps, a unique proof of the stamp, and just one of 3 known covers to have survived the 1877 balloon flight that carried mail bearing these stamps will be on display. 

ARIPEX is a World Series of Philately qualifying exhibition and any collectors or readers of this blog in the Phoenix/Mesa environs would benefit from attending.  Four 1898 tax era exhibits will be on display.  For more information about the show, go here.

Our thanks to Bob Hohertz for providing an interesting revenue imprint check drawn on The Phoenix National Bank and payable to the Central Avenue Driving Association. 

  Phoenix National Bank Check
11/22/1900
Bob Hohertz Scan
 
 
Central Avenue a major north south artery that runs through the heart of Phoenix. From the Phoenix Market Trends website we learn this interesting tidbit about the development of North Central Phoenix in the late 1900s and the role of the Central Avenue Driving Association.
 
north Central avenue "Development of the North Central Avenue area began in 1895 when William J. Murphy platted the Orangewood subdivision. This two-square mile area bounded by what are now Northern Avenue and Bethany Home Road, between 7th Avenue and 7th Street was promoted as the Orangewood Residential Village.
Murphy’s concept about Orangewood was to create a suburb of Phoenix “wherein might be established rural homes at an easy distance from the city.” He believed that the large lot size would attract upper income residents of Phoenix, wealthy outside investors and immigrants who would utilize the lots to build large estate homes surrounded by citrus groves. The subdivision was divided primarily into 20-acre size lots with Central Avenue extending through the property as the subdivision’s principal roadway.
Olive and ash trees were added along both sides of Central Avenue with citrus trees from Southern California planted on the interior portions to make the subdivision more attractive to new investors and homeowners. The exclusivity of Orangewood was evident in that at the turn of the 19th century, the Central Arizona Driving Association arranged to have Central Avenue deeded as a “driving street” for property owners to drive their horse-drawn buggies. There was even a separate path on the east side of Central Avenue for horses and riders only.

We hope we can provide a couple of blogs during the show and perhaps a photo or two as well. 
 


        

Tuesday, March 27, 2012

Garfield-Perry Stamp Show Wrap-up

Bob Hohertz's impressive 5-frame exhibit of the revenue stamp paper of the Spanish American War Era won a show gold award and an American Revenue Association gold award.  Judged to be the best of the ten revenue exhibits on display it also was awarded the ARA's Grand Award.  It also garnered one of the prestigious American Philatelic Society Medal of Excellence awards as the best exhibit of pre-1900 material in the entire show. Congratulations Bob!

Below is a shot of Bob standing in front of the first three frames of his exhibit.



The highlight of the show for me personally was the opportunity to rendevous with Bob Patetta who has been of great assistance in providing scans of material to augment my on-document blogs about the usage of the adhesive stamps of the 1898 tax period.  Bob and I first met at a Garfield Perry show some 25 years ago and hadn't seen each other since then.  We had renewed contact in recent years via the Internet -- specifically through eBay and the 1898 Revenues blog.  I'm writing this wrap-up on Monday morning because Bob and I spent hours last night reviewing the 1898 material we each had brought to the show for a show and tell session. 

I'll be featuring much more of Bob Patetta's material in upcoming blogs!
  

Thursday, March 22, 2012

Revenue Exhibits at March Party and a Big 4 Bill of Lading


I'm not certain how the Garfield-Perry Stamp Club's annual exhibition came to be called "March Party" although I've always had a good time whenever I've attended the show.  They do sponsor a nice wine and cheese reception the evening of the show's opening day; perhaps that's the "party".  The club itself is named in honor of James A. Garfield, and Oliver Hazard Perry; for more details go here.

According to list of exhibits, there will be 10 revenue exhibits at March Party totaling 56 frames, although just one exhibit of 1898 revenue material.  Bob Hohertz is showing his Revenue Stamped Paper of the Spanish American War Era exhibit. You too can view much of  the material right here on 1898Revenues as Bob is a major contributor to this site particularly in the area of revenue stamped paper.  Although I've seen his exhibit several times, I'm eager to see it once again as Bob advised in an email some months ago that he was revising the focus away from a "fiscal history" aspect to a more "traditional" presentation.  To learn more about the jargon associated with philatelic exhibits, the basic types of exhibits, and how they are judged take a look at the APS Manual of Philatelic Judging.  

Again, the Garfield Perry March Party Stamp Exhibition runs Friday, March 23 through Sunday, March 25 at the Masonic Auditorium in downtown Cleveland, Ohio.

Enough about the show, let's look at another Cleveland related document.


Cleveland, Cincinnati, Chicago, & St. Louis Railway Bill of Lading
Bellefontaine to Dayton
April 4, 1899


 

detail of boxed cancel
The C.C.C. & St. L. Ry. Co.
PASSED
APR  6  1899
BELLEFONTAINE, O.

Simon Lindemoth ships a box of meat and a can of "wired?" lard from Bellefontaine Ohio to H. S. Bergen in Dayton, Ohio.  It didn't matter how much material was shipped, nor how far, nor how many rail line transfers were necessary to complete a shipment, a bill of lading covering a shipment from one domestic destination to another was taxed a flat 1-cent.

I won't go into the history of the C.C.C. & St. L. Railway, better known as the BIG 4 Railroad, as that's been briefly covered in several previous BIG 4 blogs.  I wrote about C.C.C. & St. L. Railway Corporate Bonds, Bob Hohertz showed some Parlor Car tickets, and John featured a cancel of a subsidiary line in one of his cancel of the day blogs.  

Here's another C.C.C. & St. L. Railway cancel on a 1-cent R163 documentary that likely also is from a bill of lading.    


C. C. C. & ST. L. RY. CO.
OCT
2
1901

I'd be remiss if I didn't close with a link to the American Revenue Association website; it's their annual meeting that I'm attending at the Garfield-Perry show prompting these Cleveland-related blogs.
 


  

               

Wednesday, March 21, 2012

ARA Meeting at Garfield-Perry March Party and an interesting RN-X7 usage

After another several month hiatus, I thought I’d resume blogging by giving a shoutout to the upcoming American Revenue Association Meeting at the annual Garfield-Perry March Party Stamp Show in Cleveland this weekend and, at the same time, feature some 1898 document usages from Cleveland, Ohio.

The show runs from Friday March 23 through Sunday March 25 at the Masonic Auditorium in Cleveland. It is open to the public at no charge and features 180 frames of exhibits, more than 50 dealer booths, and postal stations for both the USPS and UN. The March Party show is a major World Series of Philately qualified philatelic exhibition and any collectors or readers of this blog residing in the Cleveland environs would surely benefit from attending. For more detailed information go here.

I don’t often blog about 1898 revenue imprint material that being Bob Hohertz’s prime area of expertise, but since altering my 1898 documentary revenue exhibit to focus more on the fiscal history of the 1898-1902 tax period rather than usages of specific stamps, I’ve included some interesting revenue imprint material to the exhibit. So I’ll depart from my normal blogs about adhesive revenues and write occasionally about some imprint usages.



Interest Bearing Security Deposit Receipt
The Cleveland Gas Light and Coke Company
October 5, 1900

The Cleveland Gas Light and Coke Company required a $5 deposit from each customer as a security for the payment of bills or other indebtedness which amount was to be refunded when a customer ceased requiring service. To obtain the refund , one needed to return the receipt issued when the initial deposit was paid. Simple payment receipts were not subject to taxation under the 1898 War Revenue Act, but this is not just a receipt.

As noted on the receipt the security deposit bore interest at the rate of 4% so in effect this gas company receipt was treated as a certificate of deposit and was taxed as such, hence the 2-cent revenue imprint printed in the center. In this instance service lasted just 6 months and the customer earned and received 10-cents in interest. I wonder who actually paid the 2-cents tax, the customer or the gas company?


Saturday, March 19, 2011

ARA Meeting in St. Louis this Weekend

As I'm on the other side of the world I'm afraid I can't make the meeting in St. Louis (apologies to Judy Garland).  But the fact of the meeting in the city with the arch got me thinking about all the associations between St. Louis and some of the more remarkable and collectable 1898 revenue items.

photo by Bev Sykes


Hermann Ivester and Jim Kloetzel of Scott have been kind enough to grant permission to republish Hermann's St. Louis Provisionals article here. 


The Antikamnia Chemical Company, one of many St. Louis pharmaceutical firms in 1898, is well known for its use of provisionals like that above, printed cancels, and a 2 1/2 cent private die stamp.

St. Louis was an important railroad hub in the midwest and a primary departure city for points west.  Many railroads took the name of the important city of St. Louis for their own:



 the St. Louis, Iron Mountain, & Southern Railway is one example.



The St. L. I. M.& S. was a part of a much large system that ran out of St. Louis that included the Missouri Pacific.


Some railroads, like the St. Louis & San Francisco Railroad, started in St. Louis but never quite made it to their other namesake.  In the case of the St. L. & S. F., or Frisco, the system never even got close to making it to San Francisco.


Others, like the Nashville, Chattanooga & St. Louis, intended to reach St. Louis, but never did.  You could have never used this railroad to meet Judy Garland in St. Louis.

****
As a kid, St. Louis always had a mystique to it, as I would listen late at night under the covers to Jack Buck calling Cardinals baseball games on KMOX.  The station was clear all the way down in New Orleans, as KMOX had a 50,000 watt clear channel medium wave signal at night.

Thursday, July 29, 2010

American Revenue Association Web Site

The ARA has a new design for its web page.  The redesign provides a more modern appearance and interactive framework.  Kudos to ARA officers and web people for updating the site.  Overall content has changed little, though you will find a link to this site on the links page! 

July 28 screen capture for the home page of the ARA web site.

Adding Content to the Site:  Links to articles and research are posted on their own page on the site.  These links make me wonder why on the page for The American Revenuer there are no links to archives of old TAR issues or articles.  This would be a great way to add content heft to the site.  And as TAR is the property of the ARA, and the site is the ARA's, doesn't the ARA have the right to post these articles, especially if the site recognizes and makes clear the copyright status of the individual authors in each issue?  I know there are lawyers in our group that could help clarify this issue, but I am certain that almost all contributors to TAR would be thrilled to have their work made more available, and that the ARA could readily protect itself with a simple disclaimer.